Economy is shot?

Druhsk · Post by **Druhsk** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 5:41 pm

Can someone please explain why the economy is shot to hell? I looked through various threads, but I don't see what happened. I'm not trying to be sarcastic or incite a flame fest, I honestly don't know . . . thanks.

Sassy · Post by **Sassy** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 5:50 pm

Druhsk, thanks for asking the question. I don't get it either

Flanker · Post by **Flanker** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 7:54 pm

From what I gather there are a lot of Sent frags around now and the small drop rate is very high now, therefore making smalls worth a lot less.

So look for the main stream of currency to be the keys from death valley and plats

Druhsk · Post by **Druhsk** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 8:01 pm

I never understood why smalls were a viable item for the economy that doesn't seem to need GSA that much. Or maybve I'm mistaken. Won't be the first, won't be the last . . . . .

Flanker · Post by **Flanker** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 8:09 pm

Anything in limited supply makes its value high.

Hence why smalls were so valuable.

Best solution I can think of

Dumoss · Post by **Dumoss** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 8:15 pm

I agree Druhsk. Smalls were only good for questing GSx armor.
GSx sells for what seven smalls now. IT takes 8 smalls and 8 frags to receive the quested GSx. The cost to make is higher than the cost to buy. hmm

So how does this work out in mathamitcal terms.

GSx = <fill in the blank>
Smalls = GSx

PS. I still use my GSA for backup armor.

Sassy · Post by **Sassy** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 8:17 pm

My GSA is all I use

. I don't know enough about armor to look for anything else

. Just wish I could dye my GSA white or pink or something. Getting tired of green.

Druhsk · Post by **Druhsk** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 8:39 pm

If the ecomony of AC is changing due to market fluctuation, then no one should really be suprised. I would think that like real economies, AC's economy will change. Granted, its changing very fast, but it is basically copying RL barter economies.

Items for sale in the marketplaces in the early 1900's were completely different from the ecomony and markets in the late 1900's. The market and economy focus actually underwent at least 3 major changes (by my estimation, other feel differently). Items that would demand a high price even 20 years can today be obtained for next to nothing.

However, when an item (such as smalls) actually trades for more than than its final product(as Ranger pointed out), that is a broken economic model. I think that the current bumper crop of smalls flooding the market is in actuallity just speeding up the inevitable.

Unless the Devs create a new use for smalls, I honestly belive theat they would eventaully phase out ans people obtain more powerfull armor tinked to their personal specs.

Ok, I'm done with today's foray into the world of economics . . . we now return you to your regularly scheduled program . . . .

/sarcasm on

D00d, th0z DEVz fub4rd teh econmy!!!11!!

/sacasm off

Flanker · Post by **Flanker** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 8:41 pm

Smalls = Motes

Flanker · Post by **Flanker** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 8:49 pm

This guy has a different look on the economy
http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?top ... replies=36

you either love it or hate it. (period)

you love it if you didnt have tradeables or were sick of shards (always have been pretty much worthless besides gsa which most have a set of) being the main driving factor. you now love it because all thoes ubar rare items you couldn't get before, you can now fill 2 mules full in a day

you hate it because there is nothing really to base the economy on now....
1. there are plats (but they burn and are still easy to get)
2. there are sings (but you use them and are still easy to get)
3. there is salvage (but you only need so much, anything beyond is just gravy, and is very very easy to get)

you also hate it cause you haveat least a pack maybe 3 4 or 5 packs of worthless smalls on your mule (cause you can now get 5 - 10 a night easily at the least, if you are hunting for them)

ok now for you that love it, ok you have 40 sorcer's orbs, rumor has it that grand inquistors are spawning in VoD for energy crystals, you can get energy crowns easy again .... these were desired by many, because they were rare AND NOT MANY PEOPLE HAD THEM!!

ok you say this is great, are you really gonna want em in two weeks wehn everyone and thier mother has them? no, not at all they will become old, boring and passe`

trading as it was is done. let me give you an example, you have the major coord helm i want.... do you REALLY want my 150 bags of steel for it? what the hell are you gonna do with 150 bags of steel? (i know that you can say What the hell were you gonna do with shards but you couldnt farm 15 smalls in a night, like how i can easily farm 15+ bags of 17+ steel in one night)

they way i have been watching auctions yesterday and todya people are auciotng only for plats....

who the hell has 5k plats for my major war helm that i just found (just an example) and no one is gonna trade me for anything less...

this will become an all barter economy....

the main argument of thoes for an all barter (i give you my lit 5 braclet for your acid 5 braclet) is that this is the way it was wwhen the game started, WAYY before Motes
yeah but now everyone has lvl 7s or buff bots so there is no need for most of the items like that in the game

most of the prepatch armor is tinkered or sitting on tradebots, it dropped so much that there is still so much of it around and most people have all they want.

or if they still have to tinker it, who needs more then 1 suit (MAYBE 2 if you have a hollow suit for pking/hollow then a nice fashionable suit for everyday wear)

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now for my main point... the main thing peple want now is plats, majors, (sometimes minors), sings (if you dont' have lping, which just get used anyway) granite/marble keys, and salvage

the problem with these are as follows (most stated already)

1. plats -you use them but never really amass the 5000 your gonna need to trade for that ubar major war helm

2 majors, -they dont drop enough to be curency, and on top of that no one will ever except that stupid major deception frying pan that you will find 9 outta the 10 majors that you find

3. sings - easily farmed, can be carrried 24 at atime in one slot, you burn them in troves, and get worthless garbage most of the time (or more stupid salvage that you can find outta a pack of nobles)

4. granite/marble keys - on VoD creatures don't drop ALL that often, still just like sing keys, your just gonna get a buncha worthless junk (only a worth a whole lotta plats)

5. salvage- you only need so much, cumbersome to hold on a mule not many good weapons to imbue left any way. i have 35 bags of steel all 6+ i am about to finish tninking out a suit of studded leather cause i hate amuli and already have a tinked amuli suit. why would i need more salvage, most feel the way i do.

so to you that think this patch is good, how many little orbs crowns, etc do you really want? are you really going to want them once EVERYONE has one? and what do you propose we do wehn there is no way to trade for that ubar major coord helm that you want unless you have that ubar major war helm they want

ps: i am gonna get flamed saying not everyone has 7s... wrong there are so many public buff bots it is sick. and everyone else has 7s, if you think this is wrong, wake up, you are kidding your self.)

unless they introduce something along the lines of a major super awesome rare hat that you can put gems in to get thing s you want (majors, super majors, super duper majors) or something like that that people want, there is no reason to loot hunt at all anymore.

just go hunt for sings, burn them in a trove, get nothing. rinse and repeat
this is all this game will amount too now
sings sings sings, burn burn burn, garbage garbage garbage

(i apologize for this being so long.)

Dumoss · Post by **Dumoss** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 10:02 pm

I was thinking more of the line as smalls = junk.

Neue Regel · Post by **Neue Regel** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 10:12 pm

Smalls = I was rich now I am not, and will not play 6 more months to regain my wealth to have them strip it away with another change. For those of you that play this game just to play, you would not understand. For those of us that had hundreds of hours invested to gain wealth so we might have a chance to purchase an uber item, like the major bow guants I was seeking, is now history because what I and many others saw as currency is now deflated to 0. So we are the ones that are pissed off at this lame unnecessary change to the game. The smalls didnâ€™t make a difference to those that didnâ€™t see value in them before or after the patch, but for those that did, it has made a 1/2 of year of my life useless in this game as well as others. So before you dis smalls and those who had them, be sensitive to those who just lost what matches up to an Enron collapse of pensions in RL to what we have lost in this game.

Druhsk · Post by **Druhsk** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 10:26 pm

I completely agree Neue . . . The sudden change in the economy did make a lot of people who were wealth through hard work suddenly poor. In fact, I am just lucky that I keep my wealth in plats and not smalls, that was just my personal preference.

And I think your analogy to the Enron-esque collapse is quite accurate. You have tons of wealth on paper, and the actions of a few made that wealth worth less than the paper its written on

Culticon · Post by **Culticon** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 10:45 pm

The small economy is not shot like they say it is I sold 8 smalls last night for 30 pts each on my bot! So pretty much all bunch of fooy lol. I think its just people that want to see the small degraded as a trade staple. I don't understand how peeps can say they are worth less when more drops. The trade note did not drop in value with the last patch since it was alot easier to make money in the form of looting and buying notes. So pretty much your foolish if u run out and sel all ur smalls cause some geek on the VN boards cry that they are worthless now. This is all just a nicely worked sham because the boards don't make the enconomy, its the demand at the the trade bots in the market do. Hey but if u think ur smalls are worthless sell them to my bot at 10 pts each and I will sell them for 30 pts each as fast as I get them. Also I killed 35 frags 5 of which were sents last nite and got 2 smalls whoopie lol, Sorry this is not a fast enough drop rate to ruin the small enconomy. So if ur scared come sell em to me since no other bots really sell smalls I sell a ton at a nice markup. You make your choice

Neue Regel · Post by **Neue Regel** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 10:50 pm

Well Culticon since I make my living IG auctioning on the bowards, and noone is accepting smalls anymore, I thinnk your theory has some big holes in it. I am hanging onto my smalls, but am seriously think of calling it quits unless things calm down.